Fabrizio Poggi: The Blues is a Miracle

Fabrizio Poggi is one of Europe’s finest exponents of the blues. Hailing from the north of Italy, Fabrizio has recorded over twenty albums and has shared stages with numerous top blues artists including The Blind Boys of Alabama, Eric Bibb and John Hammond. He’s the author of four books on the blues and has been touring this year with Guy Davis, promoting their new Sonny Terry and Brownie McGhee album. Down at the Crossroads was delighted to get the chance to chat to this blues enthusiast and master of the blues harmonica.

Photo by Riccardo Piccirillo

Fabrizio – you’re a blues harmonica player. Tell us a bit about how you started on this blues journey and what drew you to the harmonica.

To quote my good friend and harp legend Charlie Musselwhite, music in general “overtook me when I was a little child.” While other kids spent their spare time playing soccer or riding bicycles, I stayed inside all day long listening to records. Every kind of music. My favourite toys were a drum, a toy piano and, of course, an out of tune harmonica. Then one day I saw Paul Butterfield playing Mystery Train in a movie called “The Last Waltz” and my life changed forever.

Maybe nowadays it seems a little strange but most of the things I learnt in my younger days came from records. There were no computers, Google or YouTube, and musical instructional books were very difficult to find. It was hard, very hard. It took me six months to learn something that today a kid can learn in one day. Also with English language was the same. I always make a joke of it but my English teachers really were Muddy Waters and Howlin’ Wolf.

What is it about this music that you find compelling or attractive? Is it just entertainment or is there more to it?

Oh yes, much more. To me the blues is a miracle and a miracle is always difficult to explain with simple words. The miracle of the blues is that it’s so full of power and wisdom that it touches every heart throughout the world.  Mine too! It doesn’t matter where you were born, what language you speak, or what colour your skin is.  Blues and spirituals, and music in general, are amazing gifts – often from wonderful unknown singers – to heal people’s souls. With the blues I have my own connection to the shared human conditions of struggle, darkness, and pain cloaked in redemption, overcoming, and freedom.

Blues taught to be simple and humble. To love and respect people that come to my shows. To be nice with them. Because often they tell me some precious words that keep me going on when the wind of life sometimes blows too hard against me.
The blues taught me to play from the heart. Always.

I know you’ve played with a lot of well-known blues artists. Tell us about some of the people your played or toured with.

I had the privilege to share the stage, and to record with The Blind Boys of Alabama, Charlie Musselwhite, Guy Davis, Marcia Ball, Ronnie Earl, Kim Wilson,  John Hammond, Sonny Landreth, Garth Hudson of THE BAND and Bob Dylan, Eric Bibb, Ruthie Foster, Mike Zito, Bob Margolin, Flaco Jiménez, Steve Cropper, Otis Taylor, Richard Thompson…

They are so many that it’s impossible to talk about them all. We’d need a big book!

Most of them were heroes of my youth (and still they are). When I was sixteen and I was in my little room in a little town in northern Italy listening to their records, I didn’t imagine that one day I would play with them. I really feel blessed.

There are not enough words to explain how moving it was to play with these people. I still have goose bumps talking about that. It was amazing. Great artists and wonderful human beings. But having the opportunity to sing with the legendary Blind Boys of Alabama was one of the highest musical privileges in my life. Every time I listen to my recordings with them I still sit in humble disbelief hearing my voice singing with theirs. Most of them called me brother and every time I think about that I am moved to tears.

And you’ve released a couple of albums with Guy Davis, one just this year, a homage to Sonny Terry and Brownie McGhee, which has been very well received. How did this collaboration come about, and how do you find collaborating with Guy?

My first encounter with Guy Davis dates back to 2007 when we met at a blues festival in Italy. Between us was born almost immediately a deep friendship based not only on mutual respect but also about the passion we both have for the most authentic acoustic folk blues. Over the past years, our close personal links materialized in live shows, and then Guy recorded a couple of tracks on my album Spirit & Freedom. After that we did Juba Dance which I also produced artistically and I also was a special guest on Kokomo Kidd. To play at his side is something that always amazes me and makes me proud because Guy Davis really is one of the last great masters of the blues, a direct heir of Robert Johnson and John Lee Hooker.

Guy and I are extremely fascinated by the primitive sound of the blues and spirituals — the music that was played “without electricity” under the front porch of those shacks scattered among cotton fields of the Southern States. Also, the acoustic sound allows us to better tell the stories that are in and around this mysterious and magical musical genre. Every album we did together is a perfect picture of the encounter, the embrace, and the total and complete fusion between two musicians from seemingly distant worlds, light years away. Sometimes I think that this happened just because probably in another life, Guy and I were brothers and already playing the blues just for fun on the porch of our house… not just for us … but thinking about what would come next.

Tell us about the album, Fabrizio, and why you wanted to record it?

It’s another album we recorded together that I produced and is titled Sonny and Brownie’s Last Train. The CD, as the subtitle says, is a “A look back to Brownie McGhee and Sonny Terry.” I think that now it’s the time to celebrate them for a new generation. I completely agree with what Guy wrote in the liner notes explaining the concept of the recording: “Brownie McGhee and Sonny Terry were two musicians whose work will not be surpassed, let alone improved on… It features our combined musical talents, and is not meant to compete with the originals. It’s meant to be a love letter to Brownie and Sonny signed by the both of us. They were two of my favourites.” The idea for the album came from my lovely wife Angelina. One night she told me: “I’ve seen you and Guy playing together many, many times. I love it when you play together and I think that you two need to do a record dedicated to Sonny Terry and Brownie McGhee. Nobody’s done it yet, so you have to do it! You and Guy are the right musicians to do that record.” Guy and I stayed for two days in a recording studio in Milan and recorded all the songs live. The album is the result and I hope people like it. We put all our passion, love and respect for those two wonderful musicians and their music into it. I felt like they were seated in the studio with me and Guy, looking and smiling at us. The title track theme was my idea, and Guy in my opinion wrote a masterpiece just on the spot. When the song Sonny & Brownie’s Last Train was finally finished and recorded, Angelina and I were in tears. It is really a wonderful love letter to them.

When people think of Italian music, they might think of great opera or classical music, but the blues maybe isn’t the first thing people think of! So tell us about the interest there is currently in the blues in Italy.

I often say that among the great miracles of the blues is that it has become an international language; so nowadays you have great musicians playing great music all over the world. It doesn’t really matter where that musician comes from.

There are many people all around the world singing great opera tunes or playing classical music so behind the stereotypes, so why shouldn’t Italians be playing the blues? The important thing is the vibe, the connection, to be honest and sincere. So yes, there are great blues players here and many blues festivals. The blues is “alive and kickin’” in the land of pasta and pizza!

Also, I know that you’re a blues historian, Fabrizio, and have discovered that there are a number of threads that link Italy and the blues – not least that Italians that lived, worked and suffered alongside African Americans in a Mississippi plantation at the turn of the nineteenth century. Perhaps you could give us a flavour of that story?

It’s a story I discovered some years ago in Mississippi about Italian farmers and fishermen who, looking for a better life, around 1895, left their homes in Northern Italy to settle down in the cotton fields of the Delta. Their life was difficult because of the extreme conditions they had to endure: the mosquitoes carrying malaria, the frequent floods, and the racial discrimination all made their existence very hard. In 1865 at the end of the Civil War when slavery was abolished, a lot of black people, already free even if just by word of mouth, left the cotton plantations to emigrate to the northern States, leaving their owners “in difficulty.” Replacing tireless workers like the African-Americans wasn’t easy; so some owners decided to try and get other workers who were badly off but at the same time were expert labourers in the fields: the Italians. But they all were victims of a terrible trick. With the promise of a better life, men without scruples brought the Italians illegally into the United States, and then sent them on a “biblical” journey to the plantation of Sunnyside near Greenville, Mississippi, the world capital of cotton. The Italians lived and worked in close quarters with the black workers, and shared with them misery and misfortune.

Black people and Italians were not officially enslaved, but their life conditions were like real slavery. They lived in poor shacks on the sides of swamps infested by mosquitoes. Malarial fever was widespread and a lot of children died. The burden of debts oppressed Italian poor emigrants who worked hard, but were unable to emerge from a life made of “insects, scanty food and non-potable, green and stinking water.”

The Italians were often treated, if it is possible, as badly as the former slaves. And the African-Americans were the only ones who were gentle with them; they had passed through that hell, too. Together they withstood the racist vexations of the white ruling class. The Ku Klux Klan didn’t persecute just the black community, but also Italians. In the first decades of the 20th century, despite their sacrifice and their dignified misery, the Italians were considered just “ugly, dirty and bad.” In addition, some of them had dark skin and were thought of as black. In rural America, in the state of Mississippi, in that period of history, it often happened that groups of fanatical racists burned the houses, the stock pens, the schools, or the harvest of some poor Italian family. Together with black people, the Italians survived not only this, but nature’s fury: the frequent storms and floods that destroyed their poor houses.

Mississippi Juke Joint

So Italians were there when the blues were “invented.” In one book it says that “…outside Tribbett road, at Dean Plantation, there was a long wooden shed. In the first years of the 20th century, that was one of the places where black people met for playing and dancing the blues on Saturday evening, and the sound of blues was taking care of the pain of the Italians’ souls, too….” I don’t know if there are threads that link Italy and the blues. What I know for sure is that certainly the story of the “Delta Italians” is fascinating and proves that Italians along with black people, living and working together, have suffered strain and pain which gave rise to their singing. And for sure, African Americans and Italians sang in the fields. Maybe each one sang his own song. But they worked side by side in the same cotton fields, and perhaps the songs were mixed among themselves. Because music is like that; it is like the wind – it can’t be stopped.

You recorded an album with your band Chicken Mambo, entitled Mercy, which is mostly spirituals or gospel blues. Do you see some connection between the blues and faith or spirituality?

A few years ago, I read that for someone, “Hell is the experience of being separated from God.” After coming out of my deep depression, my own personal “hell on earth,” I realized that for me singing Blues and Spirituals was a way of staying connected to what I call “Heaven.”  Just as it was for African slaves in America, blues and spirituals, to me are sides of the same coin, and are my key to carrying on in this “mean ol’ world.”

What’s next for you Fabrizio?

I know that maybe it sounds pretty corny but what I really wish for my future is to play my harp until the day I’ll die. I hope on a stage! But if you want to stay tuned with my world and keep updated please visit my website www.chickenmambo.com

Fabrizio and Guy Davis are on tour during November and December in the UK.  http://guydavis.com/wp/tour/

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Grammy Nominated God Don’t Never Change – Producer Jeffrey Gaskill in Conversation

God Don’t Never Change: The Songs of Blind Willie Johnson has earned plaudits from all quarters and Grammy Award nominations for Best Roots Gospel Album and Best American Roots Performance for the Blind Boys of Alabama recording of Mother’s Children Have a Hard Time. The album was produced by Jeffrey Gaskill of Burning Rose Productions. The album features a star studded cast which includes Tom Waits, Lucinda William, Derek and Susan Trucks, Luther Dickinson and the Cowboy Junkies. Down at the Crossroads chatted with Jeffrey Gaskill to find out more about how the album came about:

DATC: First of all Jeffrey – congratulations on God Don’t Never Change. It’s a wonderful record; it’s been very widely acclaimed; it’s had two Grammy nominations. That’s no doubt been very pleasing for you – but have you been surprised at just how well it’s gone down?

Jeffrey Gaskill with Lucinda Williams

Jeffrey: I guess I’m not so surprised. I’m grateful for the Grammy nominations – I was hopeful they would come. But I like the fact that it’s gotten great reviews. These are uncertain times – everything’s uncertain, the music business is uncertain, you can’t take anything for granted. But, yes, I’m pleased with the nominations.

DATC: One writer said that your guidance resulted in “Eleven stirring renditions which replicate the soul of the songs, not just the sounds.” Presumably that was what you were striving for?

Jeffrey: Yeah, that was exactly it. Exactly. You know, just going for the heart of the song, and what Willie Johnson was saying at that time. Just bringing it up to contemporary times. And bringing artists together who can convey the song, convey the thought. Really, you know, it’s the thought in the song behind the music that matters the most.

DATC: So why did you want to do an album of Willie Johnson songs?

Jeffrey: Well I wanted to do it way back in 2003, after my Dylan project, Gotta Serve Somebody: The Gospel Songs of Bob Dylan came out. But you know, I had to give some things a rest after that and it was hard to find a label that was willing to go to bat for the project on paper before it was recorded. This was at the time the record industry was collapsing.

DATC: So what is it about Willie Johnson’s music that really appealed to you, that made you want to do this album?

Jeffrey: I think it’s the sense of permanence – and I think it’s the same thing with Dylan’s music – these are themes that everyone needs to think about in their lifetime, no matter  when in the spectrum of time they’re living their life – it’s really timeless, enduring music. It’s not something to be sung today and forgotten about tomorrow.

DATC: And that’s the thing about his music – it really has endured over the years. It’s been covered by so many artists, in so many ways over the years. There’s something about it that seems to appeal to people in different eras, perhaps coming from different genres of music.

Jeffrey: Yeah, his music can be interpreted in any number of styles, so seminal is it. He himself, we might say, is hidden in plain sight, to the extent that most everybody is familiar with at least one or two of his songs, if not all of them. Although maybe not familiar with him as an artist.

DATC: The interesting thing, Jeffrey, is that Johnson’s music is quite unashamedly Christian; it springs right out of his vibrant faith. How come people still have an appetite for it, and how come artists who may have no particular interest in faith want to cover his songs and find his songs compelling?

Jeffrey: Well, of course some people only see Blind Willie Johnson as a blues artist, with those universal themes. It takes perhaps a little bit more understanding  and appreciation of the lyrics and what he’s getting at to really fully realize him as a gospel artist, which he truly is. But he can be taken either way I guess.

DATC: Can you tell us a bit about the process of making this album, Jeffrey? From what you’ve said I gather it was a long time in the making?

Jeffrey: Labels loved the concept of the album and the artists who were interested in recording, but the budget and the financial end just wasn’t feasible while the industry was collapsing. So inevitably I wound up raising the funds through a kick starter campaign. I was grateful for kick starter, but it’s not really in my nature to want to go out and do things like that. But, you know, when your back’s against the wall, and you want to get something done like that, you’ll do what needs to be done. And then the thought came to me about his dilapidated home in Marlin in Texas that I had visited, and what could be done about the wood from it, and through some extraordinary generosity, a woman down there whom I had befriended was able to secure some wood from the house before it was demolished. And that became the Blind Pilgrim Collection – the cigar box guitars.

[Wood that had fallen free from the dilapidated house where Johnson lived with his wife and singing partner Willie B. Harris in Marlin was delivered to the capable hands of George Brin at String Tinkers in Putnam, CT.  He carefully cleaned up this old Southern Yellow Pine and painstakingly hand-made ten magnificent finger-jointed boxes book-matched front and back to create these cigar box guitars.]

DATC: And there were some guitar picks as well weren’t there? I’m kinda kicking myself – I wish I’d tried to get one of those picks!

Jeffery: Well, they were made from the same wood that the guitars were made from. I said, “do you have any scraps left?” and in fact there were three very small pieces of wood left, and so I sent them out to a fabulous pick maker out in California, and he was able to get a hundred picks out of that wood. [Chris Brossard Picks (www.brossardpicks.com)]

DATC: Wonderful. So how did you go about recruiting the artists – I mean it’s a fantastic cast on the album, and all the performances are very, very strong. So how did you go about recruiting them, Jeffrey?

Jeffrey: Well, just sending letters to management, saying, hey, I’m Jeff and I made a record called Gotta Serve Somebody: The Gospel Songs of Bob Dylan, and I’m working on this Blind Willie Johnson project, and here’s a song, and I wonder if you’d consider singing it?

One artist we tried, an Irish one other than Sinead O’Connor, was Van Morrison, but we never heard back from him. That would’ve been nice.

DATC: So you suggested songs for particular artists, rather than artists choosing?

Jeffrey: In most cases yes. With some exceptions – like for Sinead O’Connor, I think I gave her different suggestions up front and then she came back and said she wanted to do a different couple of songs. But then I gave her Trouble Will Soon be Over. So that took a little bit of back and forth. But I think we landed on the right one.

Down at the Crossroads’ review of God Don’t Never Change: The Songs of Blind Willie Johnson is here

DATC: You sure did! It’s probably the surprise of the album, but it’s really fabulous. I wouldn’t have thought of Sinead O’Connor doing a song on an album like this. But she really nails that one, doesn’t she?

Jeffrey: Yeah, she totally nails it. And when I heard that, it really surpassed any expectations I had for the record. That and the Cowboy Junkies. I’m proud of all the tracks – they’re all great – but I really feel like, Sinead O’Connor and the Cowboy Junkies take it to another level, to a real contemporary sound, and show the relevancy of the words and of Blind Willie Johnson’s music. And these are the sort of songs that can be played on the radio, you know, anywhere, anytime.

DATC: What do you think the songs of Willie Johnson have to say to the modern world? We’re going back a long time to a particular social context, to an individual in very difficult circumstances, singing songs about faith – what can these songs say to the modern world?

Jeffrey: Well I like to think that the world is an improved place since his time. But I would think Willie Johnson would think that the lessons from his songs are still relevant. I would hope there is less desperation now than there was back then, and that there would be more empathy and understanding.

DATC: Have you another project in mind, Jeffrey, or do you just want the let the dust settle a bit on this on at the moment?

Jeffrey: Yeah, maybe let the dust settle for now. I do have another project in mind, it’s more of a audio museum exhibit of shaker music. I’m from New England and this music comes from the area in which I live. It’s got real historic importance.

DATC: Sounds like a great project. Thank you Jeffrey. Again – congratulations on the album our best wishes for the Grammys.

 

In appreciation of: The Blind Boys of Alabama

The Blind Boys of Alabama, five-time Grammy Award winning gospel group, first sang together in 1944. They came together, aged around nine, in the glee club in 1944 at the Alabama Institute for the Blind in Talladega, Alabama. They recorded their first single in 1948, I Can See Everybody’s Mother But Mine, and went on to release a slew of albums over the next few decades.

In 2001, the Blind Boys released their most critically acclaimed and commercially successful album to date, Spirit of the Century, which won the 2001 Grammy award for Best Traditional Soul Gospel Album. Over the past twelve years since that, they’ve given us a number of excellent albums, including a wonderful collaboration with Ben Harper in 2004, the superb There Will Be A Light.

Atom Bomb (2005), which fused gospel with pop, rap, and the blues, the country-gospel album, Take the High Road in 2011 and then this year’s release, I’ll Find a Way, produced by Bon Iver’s Justin Vernon. Along the way, they’ve collaborated with a large number of top-flight artists from the world of the blues, pop, soul, rap and country.

In a recent interview, Jimmy Carter, a founding member of The Blind Boys of Alabama, and the only one of the original group still touring regularly, spoke about how all the members of the band were raised on gospel music and loved it, and although they had plenty of opportunities along the way to cross over to soul or rock and roll, they stuck with what they started out with. Carter said simply, “The Lord had been good to us and we love to do this, we promised God that we would never deviate from singing gospel music.”

Carter spoke of the tough times, as the Blind Boys made their way in the Jim Crow south, living in run-down hotels or rooming houses, and not able to find a decent place to eat, as they toured around. Add to the problems of being an African American in that environment, the additional problems of being blind. Yet Carter remains incredibly upbeat. He said, “I don’t mind being blind, it doesn’t bother me at all. I’m happy. I can do just about anything anybody else can do except see.” Carter came to see that his singing was a calling, a job given to him by God. Once he realized that, he says, he never complained again! “I guess it [a calling to sing] just came from up above, from him. After he told me that, you he just gave me peace, man. I just felt peace. That’s all I can say.”

This incredible positive approach to life, this defiant faith, despite life’s difficulties and trials, is something which comes across strongly in both the Blind Boys’ live performances and albums. Take the recently released I’ll Find a Way. The vibe all the way through, both lyrically and musically, is very positive. It’s based on a solid trust in God, who, for the Blind Boys, is always there, is always the rock no matter what life may throw at you.

Rainbow in the Cloud is a good example: “When it looked like the sun wouldn’t shine any more, God put a rainbow in the cloud.” That being the case, “I’ll find a way to carry it on,” they sing on I’ll find a Way. All this based on a solid faith in the underpinning goodness of God, which the album unashamedly and joyfully proclaims:

“Since I found you my whole life has changed
Since I found you, Lord, my life ain’t the same.” (I’ve Been Searching).

The Blind Boys’ approach to life is expressed simply in Take Your Burden to the Lord: “If you trust and never doubt, he will surely bring you out.” What we might need to be “brought out” of is exemplified in this verse of the song:

“If your mother dead and gone,And you’re sitting here all alone
And your burden seems so hard for you to bear
But if you be true
God will surely bring you through
Take your burdens to the Lord and leave them there.”

This dogged faith in God in the midst of trials get further expression in the excellent cover of Dylan’s Every Grain of Sand: “In the fury of the moment I can see the Master’s hand.” In the rich traditional harmonies and Vernon’s fine production, grace moves throughout. The Blind Boys, who have faced more hardship than most of us, remind us of the value of thankfulness and simple trust in the face of adversity. As one of the current line-up Ricky McKinnie recently said, “Our disability doesn’t have to be a handicap. It’s not about what you can’t do. It’s about what you do. And what we do is sing good gospel music.” That’s an attitude to life worth cultivating.